Boss Club Submitted Reviews

The following submitted reader reviews are opinions expressed by the reader, and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of this website, Tenfree or Z Bone. Furthermore, we reserve the right to redact or delete any submitted reviews at any time. [Submit Review] [All Club Detail]

Date: 6/24/2002 8:30am Name:   TenFree Subject: RE: hey tenfree... Sorry, I don't have any current info on the situation at VIP.

Date: 6/23/2002 7:56pm Name:   tom Subject: hey tenfree... Do u know of any hot girls at VIP to clock out. What happened to chyna, i heard she doesn't work there anymore?

Date: 6/21/2002 8:27am Name:   TenFree Subject: Duh, Boss Club is closed.

Date: 6/20/2002 10:21pm Name:   MissingLA Subject: Looking for Tara Last time I went to Boss Club was probably 1 1/2 years ago. There was this beautiful asian girl there named Tara. Does she still work there or is she at another club?

Date: 5/23/2002 8:34pm Name:   poke_her_man78 Subject: Dont knock on Tenfree Everyone brings up good points to some extent, however I believe that Tenfree is right on the money. He educated a "newbie" like me to the HC scene, as I was just a Strip Club and MP veteran. If anything, I think the hostesses should thank him for creating this website. He probably helped to increase the flow of people into HC's. And like any other business, it survives and flourishes on referrals and repeat business. Tenfree's statements are fair to both the hostesses and the customers. i.e. if I got FS at the Boss for $100, why the hell would I want to "just chit-chat" with someone for like $60-$80. It just doesnt make economic sense. Tenfree, i dont know if you remember me, but I just want to thank you for educating me about HC's. Who knows, I could have ended up being one of those "suckers" you talk about. I work hard for my money, as does everyone else..so why is it different for a HC girl work hard for hers?

Date: 5/23/2002 8:08pm Name:   HotNicole Subject: I am going to move this discussion to the Forum, as TenFree asked. That is where it ought to be at this point, so if you are interested my next post will be there.

Date: 5/23/2002 6:03pm Name:   TenFree Subject: [Delta] Your FAQ on tipping reflect your own experiences of course. One of the reasons you struggle to have a good club experience is because you are stingy. [TenFree]-->Oh, my! That's really rich! FYI, I do not "struggle" at all to have a good club experience. Where in the world did you get that idea? The FAQ reflects not just my experience by those of other HCers I've come in contact with over the years. And I am far from stingy. Maybe you should read the FAQ again. I said that I am willing to tip decently but not exorbitantly for service. I admit I have adjusted my tipping philosophy somewhat as a result of input from various s. It's not so much that my overall tipping has decreased, but the way I deal with no action girls is different. I used to keep them a minimum of a half hour just so it wouldn't be so obvious as to why I was dumping them. Now I cut my losses as soon as possible and I still tip them for their time. Let me briefly outline my tipping philosophy so that there can be no misundertanding where I'm coming from. In general I believe that if a girl permits light to moderate contact and doesn't give you any attitude, that warrants matching the bill. If she permits heavy-duty contact (exclusive of other "extras") then a tip of 1.5 times the bill is appropriate. While many girls probably wouldn't consider that to be a great tip, I think most would consider it to be a fair one. I know most of the s would disagree with me on this, but that is the MO I have followed over the years and almost every single girl I have danced with has been satisfied with my tips!! Keep in mind that fairness works both ways. If a hostess wants $80 to perform a certain service and someone offers her $40 and she accepts, is that fair? You bet it is! If she wants $80 and he offers her $40 and she declines and decides to wait for another customer, is that fair? You bet it is! In a free market society a seller is free to seek the highest price that the market will bear, and conversely a buyer is free to seek the lowest price that a seller will agree to. {Delta] If you can't afford to tip properly, you should stop (i) clubbing or (ii) bitching (iii) or both clubbing and bitching. You sound angry that you can't enforce your lowball tip rules. Let it go. [TenFree]-->Again, you don't have a clue as to what you're talking about. Who defines what "tipping properly" is, you? I'm not even going to dignify your ridiculous "bitching" comment with a response. I am not angry and I am not trying to "enforce" any "rules." I state in the FAQ that they aren't meant to be hard and fast rules but guidelines. If you don't believe that the tipping scale that Gr8tWhiteShark69 referred to in his post is accurate (with some variation, of course), then you are truly out of touch with the prevailing rates for service that exist in the clubs today. Even Nicole acknowleged that the scheme was pretty accurate. Several posts ago I advised Tom that he should tip no more than MP rates for extras received in an HC. Why do I say this? Let's compare the two experiences. In an HC you have to constantly watch out for other couples coming in and out of the area, the waitress, and of course security, which means you will likely have several interruptions. At an MP, however, you and the girl are alone in a private room and you have at least half an hour of uninterrupted time to do your business. An MP also has certain other amenities that aren’t available in an HC. Why pay more in an HC for a lower quality of service than you’d get in a MP?

Date: 5/23/2002 5:20pm Name:   Raja Subject: Tipping I am in love with a girl at one of the clubs. I met her two years ago. I see her every week two times, two hours each time. "And you tip her?" "Fifty dollars each time, plus $50 for the club. I spend $200 a week on her." I add up two years of this courtship: $20,000. Not only is Priscilla a complete stranger, but when we finish dancing to a few songs, she clocks me out on a punch card, whispering, "I’m not allowed to ask for a tip, but most customers feel comfortable tipping us at least 50 percent of the bill." The above came from the famous 1999 LA Weekly article LA Weekly News Feature Dance With A Stranger Most of the taxi dancers, who must be 18 to work in the clubs, say they would rather be doing something else. The majority of those who try dancing don't make it past the first week, and it's rare to find anyone who's worked longer than six months. Sometimes dancing is their sole means of support. The girls earn minimum wage and a commission based on how much they dance. The real money is in the tips. On a good night at the Flamingo, a girl can take home $100. Whatever the criteria for successful taxi dancers, today's clubowners find that just keeping enough girls around is a full-time job in itself. Although there seems to be no shortage of newcomers for the job. Meanwhile, the dancer, having convinced her suitor that there just might be a special place in her heart for a gentleman of sufficient means and proper sensitivities, finds herself walking the razor's edge, working to keep expectations high while deferring delivery. "You get to know the girls pretty well," says Jones, the electronics salesman. He himself dances rarely, if ever. "I'm real nice to the girls. If you treat 'em real nice, then they're nice to you. Most of these guys are jerks. They treat 'em like hookers." What do taxi dance clubs have to offer that brothels don't? In a taxi dance hall, money is more an instrument of ingratiation than negotiation. The key perhaps is the thin veneer of romance, however artificial. On the other hand, sometimes it's more basic than that. The above came from a LA Times magazine article July 15,1990. The tipping standard was established long before you were born and if you are able to get a newbie to tip more then more power to you. But remember that hostess clubs in LA are a lower middle class phenomenon. HC’s or there like do exist in the orient so a large percentage of Asian customers are suits so they are available. But if you think most guys will tip double the bill for basic service you are dreaming. For that amount of money strip clubs become a good deal. I once had a hostess tell me that she deserved a higher tip because she is so hot. Well I wasn’t there to look at her. I also didn’t get any social points for being with a hot girl because it is a commercial situation. I paid and everyone who sees me in a HC knows that I’m paying. So what do I care if you are marginally or extremely better looking then the next girl. In my case I care about your personality and just because you think that you are better then your counterparts doesn’t mean that I agree. Just the statement that you are better then the others, who are my friends, is a turn off.

Date: 5/23/2002 4:06pm Name:   Delta Subject: [TenFree] One of the things I was attempting to do with the FAQ is keep the playing field level. [Delta] Your FAQ on tipping reflect your own experiences of course. One of the reasons you struggle to have a good club experience is because you are stingy. [TenFree] It may sound dramatic, but one veteran describes the new breed of HC customer brought onto the scene by the internet as a "horde of locusts and a cancerous tumor that leaves devastation and destruction in its wake." {Delta] If you can't afford to tip properly, you should stop (i) clubbing or (ii) bitching (iii) or both clubbing and bitching. You sound angry that you can't enforce your lowball tip rules. Let it go.

Date: 5/23/2002 8:25am Name:   TenFree Subject: [Nicole]--><snip>What I said is that if you guys succeeded in holding down the tip prices, some of the best girls, who do have other options, would not bother with these places. I imagine, however, that this loss of quality might be more among the category of low action girls which are of little interest to you regular customers and may not matter much to you. [TenFree]-->Agreed. [Nicole]-->I still disagree with some of the claims made on this site about tipping. <snip> I don't know exactly what the other girls get, but I believe that I get more on average for the same types of activities. I am sure it just depends on the girl. <snip> [Nicole]-->I only disagree with the claims made for the legal activities going on. [TenFree]-->If illegal activities could normally be had at Boss for $100 or less, why should it be surprising that the going rates for legal activities would be significantly less? <snip> [Nicole]-->I am not suggesting that the options available to me are common. I think I am the exception, not the rule. Much of what you guys are saying may apply to the other girls, it just doesn't apply to me. <snip> [TenFree]-->That's exactly the point! Your experience is not the rule. Earlier you said that you found it humorous that some of us actually believe that tipping the bill is the "accepted" practice. If you actually worked at Boss as you claim, then you know there was a sign just outside the main entrance to the club advising that a minimum tip of $27 an hour was required.....or maybe it said recommended, I'm not sure. At any rate, where do you think they came up with that figure? On my very first visit to an HC nearly 12 years ago, I didn't know what to expect. I clocked in what I considered to be one of the better looking girls at Club Flamingo, or at least among those available at the time, and she was the one who told me that it was customary to match the bill (at that time it was $21 an hour). Several months later I visited Starlight, the most expensive of the downtown clubs. I wasn't quite sure what the protocol was there as they have a different setup than the other downtown clubs, what with the mama-sans and all. I queried one customer that I recognized as a regular on the club circuit who had a reputation for being a big spender as to the tipping protocol, and he also told me that I should match the bill. Any HC veteran knows this is the long-standing custom. [Nicole]-->All I said on this site was that I am better than most of the girls you would find in the strip clubs. [TenFree]-->Unless you've worked in strip clubs before or patronized them extensively, how would you know that? <snip> [Nicole]-->Still, I was telling Tom what I really do make and expect to make. The numbers I suggested need not apply to all the hostesses, but they do apply to me, and plenty of guys appear to think that it is worth it. [TenFree]-->I suppose "worth" is another relative term. In my opinion the main reason the big tippers tip so much is simply because they can! A secondary reason may be to impress the girls. Don't kid yourself that all these guys who pay you big bucks to see you on the outside just want the company of an attractive young woman. Even if you may not do anything to lead them into thinking you are going to take things any further, I'd be willing to bet most of them are hoping for exactly that. They may be too shy or whatever to tell you, but in all likelihood they have a hidden agenda.....either they hope one day they'll get lucky or else they have fantasies that perhaps eventually you'll develop feelings for them. [Nicole]-->One last observation: It seems that you guys would like it if every HC customer would consult this site before tipping so that you could all work together to keep the cost of going to HC's down. I don't disagree that it could get expensive if you went regularly and I would want to limit these costs, too. My point is that this approach, if totally successful, might have negative consequences. What I think is that a lot of the better girls would tolerate some lower tips now and then from regulars since they will make up for it with guys who pay more. This way, regulars who know the system get better quality for their dollars than they would get if all the tips were low. Maybe you should be glad that there are some wealthy guys blowing a lot of money. It keeps girls around for you to clock in who would otherwise find something else. [TenFree]-->I suppose it's only "fair" that a girl occasionally gets an overtipper, in the same sense that it is fair that we occasionally get a girl who provides high mileage at a relatively inexpensive rate. Overtipping newbies will always be part of the mixture. I make a distinction, however, between guys who overtip because they are inexperienced and don't know any better and rich "suits" with no apparent appreciation of the value of money who freely throw it away for no action. There will always be those in the latter group, and they make it tough enough for the rest of us as it is. The girls are more than capable of looking out for themselves. Thus we as customers need to concern ourselves with looking out for our own interests. One of the things I was attempting to do with the FAQ is keep the playing field level. At one time HCs were a more or less "underground" phenomenon, but since the advent of the internet it's a whole new ballgame. In light of the publicity heaped on HCs on such sites as TUSCL and the recent closings in COI, there are those who feel that it will ultimately bring about the death of HCs as we know them. It may sound dramatic, but one veteran describes the new breed of HC customer brought onto the scene by the internet as a "horde of locusts and a cancerous tumor that leaves devastation and destruction in its wake."

Date: 5/23/2002 6:21am Name:   Raja Subject: Tipping HC’s experiences are varied for everyone when I first started in this game 10 years ago I only tipped ½ the bill but I noticed that by tipping the bill more girls would take me behind the pole at Flamingo. Over the years and by talking to the fellows in the clubs my practices seemed to be in line with the going rate. It even got to the point that the famous LA Weekly article on hostess clubs had a HG stating that most girls are comfortable with receiving ½ of the clock. Do some girls make more?. Of coarse you do . You specialize in drawing in suits and setting up outside dates with them. Yes these guys will throw for a night with you without any sex involved but if a guy is on the net looking for info on this game he is not a suit. Besides you don’t have to be particularly hot to draw a suit. You just have to be white looking or Asian looking enough without a tattoo showing in the wrong place or a roll of fat around the middle.

Date: 5/22/2002 12:32pm Name:   HotNicole Subject: Sharkeyboy: I never said there would be a shortage of girls. There have been plenty of them in industries like this since time immemorial. What I said is that if you guys succeeded in holding down the tip prices, some of the best girls, who do have other options, would not bother with these places. I imagine, however, that this loss of quality might be more among the category of low action girls which are of little interest to you regular customers and may not matter much to you. I still disagree with some of the claims made on this site about tipping. My experience has been to average 1 1/2 to 2 times the bill or more, whether you want to believe it or not. I don't know exactly what the other girls get, but I believe that I get more on average for the same types of activities. I am sure it just depends on the girl. The tipping scheme outlined on this site is probably pretty accurate for the more "advanced" services. It seems all types of jerking, sucking and fucking are going on for $100 or less. I only disagree with the claims made for the legal activities going on. I will say that some of the girls got a lot more for some of the illicit services. In particular, I remember one who got $150 for a BJ. This wasn't an attempt to drive up accepted prices for regulars, though. She was one of the "low mileage" girls who just really needed to pay the rent that month. I imagine there are a lot of girls there who don't normally do much who would, for the right price and having the financial need to do so, would perform these services. You aren't necessarily going to be able to get this for the regular rates, though. Nothing I have written has been fantasy. I have to admit that I am a little suprised at what has developed myself, but that does not change the fact that my situation as I relate it is completely true. I am not suggesting that the options available to me are common. I think I am the exception, not the rule. Much of what you guys are saying may apply to the other girls, it just doesn't apply to me. One thing for sure is that I am not controlled by hostess club regulars. HC's account for 10 to 20 percent of my income and this number just keeps falling. I am practically an ex-hostess club girl already. Of that amount, maybe 5 percent of my money comes from tips at the levels you guys are suggesting. If these are tips from the regulars who follow this site, you control less than 2 percent of my income. That is no control at all. Hot is relative I guess. I am hot enough that many nights I never even got to the couch. I had guys grabbing me in the parking lot and walking in with me because they knew I wouldn't be available long once I got inside. I had other guys wait all night for the chance to dance with me. I certainly don't think I am the greatest, and there is plenty about myself that I wish was better, but guys have always responded to me anyway. All I said on this site was that I am better than most of the girls you would find in the strip clubs. As far as my comments to TenFree, I must admit that I was not paying attention to the fact that this is his site and I may have been less critical had I known this. Based on what he says in this site, I think he is probably pretty cool to the girls and treats them fairly. Still, I was telling Tom what I really do make and expect to make. The numbers I suggested need not apply to all the hostesses, but they do apply to me, and plenty of guys appear to think that it is worth it. One last observation: It seems that you guys would like it if every HC customer would consult this site before tipping so that you could all work together to keep the cost of going to HC's down. I don't disagree that it could get expensive if you went regularly and I would want to limit these costs, too. My point is that this approach, if totally successful, might have negative consequences. What I think is that a lot of the better girls would tolerate some lower tips now and then from regulars since they will make up for it with guys who pay more. This way, regulars who know the system get better quality for their dollars than they would get if all the tips were low. Maybe you should be glad that there are some wealthy guys blowing a lot of money. It keeps girls around for you to clock in who would otherwise find something else.

Date: 5/21/2002 11:37pm Name:   Gr8tWhiteShark69 Subject: NotHOT Nicole speaks fantasy Miss NOT Hot Nicole, Number #1 thing to remeber is GUYS are the ones with cash and cash controls your greedy little mind. So we control you. There will never be a shortage of girls but there can be a shortage of good customers. Why do you tell such stories. I have seen probably every girl that ever came through TBC and there is not one girl that is UPPER LEVEL strip club material except for blonde Tori. IF you are so hot why do you sit on the couch at all? All the attractive girls I know are continually clocked out with almost zero down time. If you are talking about lap dances and are expecting $50 bucks for 45 minutes and you worked at TBC then you can be none other then the delusional Regina. Do you always wear short tight hot pants and a tight halter top to show off your small b cups? If you are not Regina then you are not a hot girl who gives good lap dances. Anyway I appreciate your self confidence but THERE IS NO GIRL AT TBC OR SMOKEYS NOW OR EVER that is worth $60-$100 hr for no action. The HC vets will always get a BJ or FS for those rates. Every girl I know charges $80-100/hr plus hotel for fucking on the outside. I have several girls a week calling me and begging me to fuck them for the customary $80-100/hr and so do all my friends. Doctors and lawyers don't have time to waste with HC girls. They are banging top notch escorts which you and every TBC and Smokeys girl are not. HC girls know their place on the food chain. BTW top notch escorts are not worth the extra money and those guys are throwing away cash but as you say they must be in miserable marriages or not want to hassle with getting it for free in a regular night club. I won't debate there is some IDIOT that pays you money for your company only but just because there is one or more MORONS it does not mean you are going to convince Tom and other newbies to be your newest prey. Just as you have idiots on crack who pay you on the outside for no action, there are guys like myself and others who fuck HC girls on the outside for free. It will always be this way. As long as Tenfree and I are around we will always do our best to educate the newbies to the acceptable tipping scale of $40,60, 80-100 for the three levels of action and $0 for no action attitude girls and half to equal to the clock for nice girls with no attitude who are no action. I and other vets have tipped this way for years and the girls all respect me more since they know I tip fair and know I am a good customer who they can't take advantage of. I have tipped $0 when warranted and it has never hurt my reputation only enhanced it. If the money you make is not worth it then why don't you pursue one of the many options you speak of. TRUST ME WE WON"T MISS YOU. HC clubs have been around before you were born and will be around long after you quit. Try making the money you make now at Mcdonald's or some clothing store. You are one of the many spoiled bitches that one day will wake up and realize how good you have it right now at any size tip. HC CLUBS ARE NOT AND NEVER WILL BE COMPARABLE TO STRIP CLUBS no matter how hard Amos and Lee at Smokeys try. HC guys go to HC clubs becuse they are not stupid and weak enough to be ATM machines at a Strip Club. BTW Ratpack023, girls are sharkettes, guys like me are Sharks. Also Miss NOT HOT Nicole, anyone who attacks Tenfree is not going to make many friends here or in the clubs. You remind me of a girl(but you are not her )who told me that she never fucks for less then $300. I laughed and ten minutes later we were fucking for the agreed upon $80. Maybe you should turn to wrting fantasy novels since that is exactly what most of what you wrote is!

Date: 5/21/2002 3:45pm Name:   HotNicole Subject: OK, lets get a few things straight: RatPack023: I don't think you know who I am. My name is not Nicole and I do not go by Nicole in the clubs. I do go out with customers on the side. Actually, meeting people to go out with on the side is one of the main reasons I go to the hostess bars now and then. The money you make there just really isn't worth it by itself. It is a place to make contacts. Many of the guys I meet are doctors and lawyers and into real estate. I do get paid over $100 an hour on a regular basis when I meet these guys on the side. I have one customer who wants to spend 10 hours a week with me and gives me about a hundred an hour. He wants the company of an attractive young woman but doesn't want to deal with a girlfriend. When you have as much money as he does, it is a lot cheaper to pay me that than to end up with a wife that takes half of everything. I know a few guys who have paid millions going the marriage route, and I don't blame them for preferring this. I have a boyfriend, and I tell all of my customers that I do. I do not lead any of them into thinking I am going to take things any further. I am not a prude and don't mind doing a little more on the side than I will do in the clubs, but I do not have sex with any of them. I have never asked anyone for money up front or negotiated what the price will be before we danced. Every tip I have received has been completely voluntary. I have actually only refused to be clocked in by a guy one time, and that was a notorious regular at the boss who was really gross. I don't think it is unreasonable to expect the guys to be clean when they show up to dance. I think that the guys who don't tip me much do not bother to clock me in again because they want to do more than I am willing to do. That is fine. While any of you may disagree with what I want to be paid to do this stuff, the fact is that if I don't make what I want, I just won't go. You guys can team up together and try to keep the tips down, but if you actually succeded in doing this, you'd be left with nothing but the lowest quality, most desperate girls in the clubs. Girls like me won't bother. There are plenty of other options available to me. I find it humorous that some of you actually belive that tipping the bill is the "accepted" practice. From my experience, about 10 percent of my customers tip the way that you guys are proposing. If the majority did, I wouldn't even bother with hostess clubs.

Date: 5/21/2002 12:25am Name:   Ratpack023 Subject: yep i hear you Tom. i'm with you on your tipping philosophy. tip the ones who deserve it. have you been to Club Fantasy downtown yet? much better than Smokeys. lots of hotties. decent mileage. good and bad attitudes. also, for all around experience, i like LA Grand. tons of girls. might have to look around, but you can find quite a few diamonds in the rough. never had a girl there give attitude over tipping. check out both of the aboves review sections. see what you think.

Date: 5/20/2002 11:40pm Name:   tom Subject: Well... I think the safest thing is to stick with one or two girls each time. I clock out the same girl at vip each time and pay the same tip each time. I can understand both hot nicoles point as well as tenfree and ratpack's comments. there are some girls that make worth the tip but then there are others who i feel like not tipping at all because (a) they asked for money upfront and (b) they exhibit a bad attitude and allow no touching. Well , this is an interesting subject, especially at the place i go to -VIP lounge. If i do not clock out the girl i usually clock out then i normally do not tip much because there isn't much allowed. However, when boss was open,i tipped more and it seemed more girls expected more tip than at VIP. Also, at boss club, way more mileage was allowed. So, what club has the best quality girls? I thought Boss did , there were a lot of young girls in shape. VIP has its share of over 35 year olds and out of shape girls. I probably should visit smokeys soon to see the quality of girls there.

Date: 5/20/2002 8:39pm Name:   Ratpack023 Subject: [delta]-"This Board is soundly hostile to dancers. Dancer's participation should be welcomed and encougared." ---> This Board is not hostile to dancers. That doesn't even make sense. There are plenty of positive reviews on this site about both girls and clubs. Anybody, dancer or not, would of course be welcomed here. But does that mean we should allow them to mislead newbies? Would you teach a kid to swim by throwing him into a pool full of sharks???? Then, when the shark attacks the child would you call the man who saves him "hostile"? [delta]-"A diversity of views on tipping should be OK, not lead to personal attacks." ----> God, has this mindless attitude of ultimate political correctness even made it to hostess clubs??? why should it be "ok"? we aren't talking diversity here.... a dancer told a guy how much he should tip.... it was then pointed out that she was greatly exaggerating the norms. [delta]-"I tip in accordance with my ability to tip and expectation of service" ----> so, let's say a guy makes 10x the average salary. when he goes out to eat should he leave 10x the standard tip? "...expectation of service"...well, that's pretty foolish. most people based on service received...not what they expected it to be. [delta]-"tips are always twice the amount of the bill (not just the same as the bill) and often signficantly more" ---->ah yes, i've heard of your kind. the girls i dance with always have a good laugh with me about you guys who think you can win her heart if you throw enough money at it. [delta]-"i get good service generally and feel good about helping dancers, many of whom are illegal immigrants. I also give several dancers free immigration help. I have several relationship, both sexual and not, that I value highly" ----> so you have a Saint or Pretty Woman complex. you want to SAVE the dancers... many guys in the strip club scene are like that too. Don't get me wrong...i feel for some of these girls too...but not most of them. But don't pretend to have some altruistic holier than thou mission in your heart. your patronage helps keep these girls working in the sex industry. [delta]-"There are no rules about how much to tip. Just as mileage will vary, so will the expectations of the dancers and the willingness of the customers" ----> "rules"? give it a name. call it rules, or standards, or norms....it's still there.

Date: 5/20/2002 8:13pm Name:   Ratpack023 Subject: sensible tipping v dancers wishes "[hotnicole]- Tom: $20-30 for 20 to 25 minutes is usually fine, but you should tip based on how much you enjoy yourself" --->Tom $20-30 for 20-25 minutes is BEYOND fine. Of course a dancer is going to encourage (ie, trick) you to tip more. An average experience with a girl will call for matching the clock at best. that is, 20 minutes time, around $9 bill....give the girl a $10 tip. A decent hour with a girl...give her $30. any reasonable girl will be happy with that. "As far as how much I am tipped in general, I wouldn't mind so much if I made 30 or 40 bucks an hour. The problem is that I have to sit around a long time at times when there aren't any guys there." ---> lack of guys probably means that the girls are trying to hussle the guys who do show up, they get tired of the hussle, and stop coming. therefore, the sharks have to swim on the couches until a sucker comes along. Then they try to convince this sucker that because they're having a slow night, and had to drive far, etc... they need a big tip. "If I am getting double the bill but only busy half the night, I am doing ok." ----> what morons are tipping double the bill... i've been to smokey's....it ain't happening. If a girl finds hostess club money just "ok", i would think she would always be free to try to make $30-40 an hour (as she claims) at a real job. "You also have to realize that I have to travel a long way to get there and drive alone in the middle of the night. Considering all we do and the circumstances, it just wouldn't be worth it if we didn't make this kind of money." ----> your travel time. not our problem. "I have to laugh at this TenFree guy." ---> laugh away. TenFree's advice has reached probably most of the guys who visit hostess clubs. his FAQs is how i found the places. who do you think guys are really listening to when it comes to advice on tipping? a disgruntled dancer, or an experienced customer. "No, he doesn't have to tip me what I want, but it will be the last time he dances with me, and all the girls there will know what he's all about right away." ----> if a guy is smart, and a girl doesnt provide appropriate service, then begs for a tip, he won't want to dance with her again anyway. what you girls have to understand is that it's a buyers market. there's always another girl or another club to visit. who cares is the sharks think a customer is cheap!!! "I have regular customers who pay me a hundred an hour and more to go out to dinner and see a movie. I don't see how he is so amazed that I want at least 30 bucks for a half an hour in the club. You will pay a hell of a lot more for that time in a strip bar, and I look a hell of a lot better than a lot of the girls you will find there" ----> ok...i saved this part for last for a reason. i made 3 trips to smokeys...the place sucks. on my third and final trip i danced with this Nicole chick. NO ONE is paying this girl $100 an hour for anything! On the Tom Leykus LA Scale, she's a 6 at best. She does NOT, i repeat NOT, "look a hell of a lot better than a lot of the girls you will find" at strip clubs. She was ok to talk to, ok to dance with, probably would have given up the mileage, but didn't interest me enough to try. I probably danced with her 1/2 hour and tipped matched the bill...with NO complaints from her. she told me to come back and see her. Also, she's a bit of a liar...she told me that while NUMEROUS men ask her out (and somehow they are all doctors), she never goes out with customers. After Nicole i danced with a cute little latina girl. good grinding, gave me "a hand", and was "open" to my hands as well.....her i tipped $40 for an hour...and she was happy. So Tom...dont be fooled. there are girls sitting on the couches right next to the delusionary "princesses" who will take care of you and appreciate a fair tip. they, are worth your time.

Date: 5/20/2002 5:37pm Name:   TenFree Subject: RE: Dancers and Tipping [Delta]-->This Board is soundly hostile to dancers. Dancer's participation should be welcomed and encougared. A diversity of views on tipping should be OK, not lead to personal attacks. [TenFree]-->Those who are familiar with my posting history know that I have never been hostile to a dancer. I am perfectly OK with having a diversity of views on tipping. What I was attempting to do was educate Tom that it's not necessary to just go along with whatever a HG claims is an appropriate tip. If every guy did that it would soon skew the tipping structure in a way that might be advantageous for the girls but certainly not for us....and as far as any "personal attack," I was merely responding in kind. [Delta]-->I tip in accordance with my ability to tip and expectation of service. My tips are always twice the amount of the bill (not just the same as the bill) and often signficantly more. I get good service generally and feel good about helping dancers, many of whom are illegal immigrants. I also give several dancers free immigration help. <snip> [TenFree]-->I also tip in accordance with my ability to pay and for service rendered, not expected. What a customer tips is up to him...but based on the collective experience of myself and my personal associates, "good" service can often be had for less than twice the bill and twice or significantly more than 2 x the bill is almost always accompanied by very good service. It's all well and good that you want to help out dancers because you feel sorry for them, but I've found that even those whom we might be inclined to think of as "less fortunate" can be just as mercenary as the next girl. At the end of the night, it's all about the . [Delta]-->There are no rules about how much to tip. Just as mileage will vary, so will the expectations of the dancers and the willingness of the customers. [TenFree]-->Agreed, that's why I put "rules" in quotes. However, there are generally accepted tipping standards that anyone who has been in the game for any length of time is familiar with. Let me make one thing clear....I don't think I have a right to expect a girl to accede to any expectations of mileage on my part. By the same token, I don't think any HG has a right to expect me or anyone else to tip $25-$30 per half hour just for the "pleasure of her company." As someone else recently said on another board, "the sense of entitlement some of these girls have is unbelievable. i guess it comes from the suckers who over tip week after week." And that's coming from someone who doesn't seek high mileage.

Date: 5/20/2002 3:12pm Name:   Delta Subject: Dancers and Tipping This Board is soundly hostile to dancers. Dancer's participation should be welcomed and encougared. A diversity of views on tipping should be OK, not lead to personal attacks. I tip in accordance with my ability to tip and expectation of service. My tips are always twice the amount of the bill (not just the same as the bill) and often signficantly more. I get good service generally and feel good about helping dancers, many of whom are illegal immigrants. I also give several dancers free immigration help. I have several relationship, both sexual and not, that I value highly. There are no rules about how much to tip. Just as mileage will vary, so will the expectations of the dancers and the willingness of the customers.

Date: 5/20/2002 8:59am Name:   TenFree Subject: RE: Hi Tom [Nicole]-->Tom: <snip> you should tip based on how much you enjoy yourself [TenFree]--> I agree wholeheartedly! [Nicole]--><snip> it seems someone else is getting annoyed with our conversation. I don't see the problem as the club this forum is referring to NO LONGER EXISTS!!! <snip> [TenFree]-->Irrelevant. My comments concerned tipping practices in general, not at any particular club. [Nicole]-->As far as how much I am tipped in general, I wouldn't mind so much if I made 30 or 40 bucks an hour. The problem is that I have to sit around a long time at times when there aren't any guys there. If I am getting double the bill but only busy half the night, I am doing ok. You also have to realize that I have to travel a long way to get there and drive alone in the middle of the night. Considering all we do and the circumstances, it just wouldn't be worth it if we didn't make this kind of money. [TenFree]-->Don't mean to sound cold, but that's not our (the customers') problem. And what do you mean by "considering all we do?" I thought you said you were a "good girl," which means you probably don't do much. That's your prerogative, but if a girl can't make it in this line of work then she should do something else. [Nicole]-->I have to laugh at this TenFree guy. I have regular customers who pay me a hundred an hour and more to go out to dinner and see a movie. [TenFree]-->No, I have to laugh at the suckers who tip you that much thinking maybe they'll get lucky or even have a "relationship" with you. As the saying goes, a fool and his money are soon parted. [Nicole]-->I don't see how he is so amazed that I want at least 30 bucks for a half an hour in the club. You will pay a hell of a lot more for that time in a strip bar, and I look a hell of a lot better than a lot of the girls you will find there. [TenFree]-->Apples and oranges. The reason strip clubs are so expensive is because they're a rip-off, plain and simple. The difference is you're paying by the dance, not by the time. You can't really compare the two because hostess clubs are a completely different ballgame with a different set of "rules" and customs. [Nicole]-->No, he doesn't have to tip me what I want, but it will be the last time he dances with me, and all the girls there will know what he's all about right away. [TenFree]-->And if I or any of my friends danced with you, we'd know what you were all about right away as well....just another money grubbing ette.

Date: 5/19/2002 9:42pm Name:   HotNicole Subject: Hi Tom Tom: $20-30 for 20 to 25 minutes is usually fine, but you should tip based on how much you enjoy yourself I don't blame you for not wanting to post your email. I don't want to either, but it is easy enough to open another account. Better do it fast as it seems someone else is getting annoyed with our conversation. I don't see the problem as the club this forum is referring to NO LONGER EXISTS!!! But whatever. As far as how much I am tipped in general, I wouldn't mind so much if I made 30 or 40 bucks an hour. The problem is that I have to sit around a long time at times when there aren't any guys there. If I am getting double the bill but only busy half the night, I am doing ok. You also have to realize that I have to travel a long way to get there and drive alone in the middle of the night. Considering all we do and the circumstances, it just wouldn't be worth it if we didn't make this kind of money. I have to laugh at this TenFree guy. I have regular customers who pay me a hundred an hour and more to go out to dinner and see a movie. I don't see how he is so amazed that I want at least 30 bucks for a half an hour in the club. You will pay a hell of a lot more for that time in a strip bar, and I look a hell of a lot better than a lot of the girls you will find there. No, he doesn't have to tip me what I want, but it will be the last time he dances with me, and all the girls there will know what he's all about right away.

Date: 5/17/2002 1:25pm Name:   tom Subject: To tenfree and hot nicole.. I would say that i tip probably between what both of you say. I normally tip more than the time fee unless the girl asked for money upfront or seemed rude then i will tip less than the time fee or nothing. For example, at boss club, a girl asked for 40 upfront for touching and she would simply not dance on the dance floor. It was couches or nothing. So i walked out and tipped nothing. Also i reread the articla about HC's and i believe i normall clock a girl out for about 20-25 min and tip 20-30 dollars. 40 if she is the one girl at vip who i clock out for extra mileage. Umm i may give you(hot nicole) my email but i want to make a new account. Im not sure i trust putting my regular email out on this board

Date: 5/17/2002 9:14am Name:   TenFree Subject: RE: For Tom Nicole writes: "To answer your question about dancing and sitting for a 1/2 hour and just touching outside the clothing. I would be happy with 40 bucks. 30 bucks would be okay, but anything less I am not happy at all." Tom, go back and read the section in my FAQ on tipping. Also read the posts on MP rates in the reviews of LA Grand. Basically, in an HC you should tip no more than MP rates, and that's only when you receive "extras." Those are more or less the going rates that have been established in these clubs. As I state in the FAQ, the standard tip for a session such as you asked Nicole about is to match the bill. This is well known throughout the HC realm. For $40, most customers either get to spend a full hour with the girl or get some action, or both. In the example above, $30 for a 1/2 hr. no action session is more than double the bill. That works out to $60 an hour! To expect that much for merely dancing, sitting, and touching outside the clothing is tantamount to extortion. Anyone foolish enough to give in to such demands is grossly overtipping and spoiling the girls. Remember, you are in charge of how much you tip, not the girls. You should tip them fairly to be sure, but don't ever let them dictate to you how much to tip. Lastly, discussions of this nature should be moved to the discussion forum. This section of the site is for reviews.

Date: 5/16/2002 9:18pm Name:   HotNicole Subject: For Tom Hi again. To answer your question about dancing and sitting for a 1/2 hour and just touching outside the clothing. I would be happy with 40 bucks. 30 bucks would be okay, but anything less I am not happy at all. But you know you can't really touch too much since those security guards don't really allow it. The girl has to have her hands on top of the guys neck when dancing. I was told that having my hands around the guys waist is not allowed. I just don't know if you would like this club. Oh, but if you are willing to meet a girl outside the club you have to pay her of course. I am sure you know that, but only if you click with the girl. Well, I am going out of town. If you feel comfortable giving me your e-mail address, I can contact you there. Maybe then you will figure out who I am. But only if you are comfortable. Bye 4 now... ;-P

Date: 5/16/2002 9:10am Name:   tom Subject: Oh i forgot to answer a question You asked if i thought it would be better to meet a girl there and then go out outside ofthe club. Yes i do think thats a great idea. Althoough, im not sure how many girls are willing to do that, ive never really asked. Although one girl at minato asked me to go with her to the mountains to do some "stuff" but i graciously backed out because she was probably 10 years older thanme and im not sure i trusted her. But i do thinkit would be fine to just hang out somewhere with one of the girls.

Date: 5/16/2002 9:05am Name:   tom Subject: hmm.. not sure im as eager to go although my motivation would be to see if i could find you. As for the tipping thing, yes i do believe a 45 min lap dance warrants at least 50 dollars. I never was real sure about how much to tip girls. At VIP,not all the girls did much so guys didnt tip too much except for a few girls. Maybe ill go try smokeys out soon although if the le keep coming its really going to kill business. hey, heres a question, if a guy just dances with and touches , and u site down for a while for about half an hour, what would a fair tip be?

Date: 5/15/2002 2:14pm Name:   HotNicole Subject: Hi again Tom... Yes it was raided. Glad I was not there because some guys and girls got arrested. That sucks huh? So now it is so slow. Kind of sucks for me when there are more girls than guys. But it is okay, I still make nice tips. I read comments about tipping and how girls expect a big tip. Well, this is how I look at it, matching the bill is fine when I am not doing a lap dance, but if I am doing a lap dance for 45 minutes, I want at least 50 bucks. Sorry but that is just me. But we can't do lap dances at Smokeys anymore. To be honest, I don't know if you would like Smokeys since there is no lap dancing, and the security guard watches you like a hawk. Don't you think it would be better to meet a girl there and ask to meet outside the club? Try that if you are interested. Smokeys is on Garvey. If you are going on the 10 west, get off at Baldwin Park, make a right, get in the left lane because you will be making a quick left on Tracy. When you make that left you will make a quick left on Garvey. Than go down that street. It's on the left side. It is a nice place inside but the area seems not too good. But I feel safe since they do have guards outside. Try it out. Maybe you will end up dancing with me. That would be funny. Do you think you can find me? :-)

Date: 5/9/2002 11:36pm Name:   tom Subject: Thanks Hot nicole... its cool, thats understandable not wanting to put your name on this site. Umm actually i haven't been there yet, i heard there was a raid or something. Where is it at? I know its in baldwin park but how do u get there from valley?

Date: 5/8/2002 4:51pm Name:   HotNicole Subject: Hi Tom Yes a lot of the girls from Boss went to Smokey's. Have you gone yet? I really don't know any girls' names, sorry. I use my real name at the club, but it is not Nicole. I don't want to put my real name online.

Date: 4/25/2002 10:44pm Name:   tom Subject: hey hot nicole... Do u know any girls from Boss that moved to smokeys and if so any names? Also, how are the other girls at the place? And do u go by nicole at the place?

Date: 4/23/2002 3:18pm Name:   HotNicole Subject: Try Smokey's guys... Hello. Yes it sucked that the Boss closed. They may relocate in a couple weeks. I'll keep you posted. I heard there is a female mayor who wanted all the clubs shut down in city of industry. I tried Smokey's in Baldwin Park. It's off the 10fwy on Garvey. I was there Saturday. It was fun. I just hope more guys will go there. I don't want to work in downtown, too far. Well, I hope to see you all at Smokey's until Boss will relocate.

Date: 4/16/2002 9:12am Name:   TenFree Subject: RE: ALL? In the case of Boss I heard it was "licensing issues." That's all I know. I haven't heard anything about VIP closing either (yet).

Date: 4/15/2002 11:25pm Name:   tom Subject: ALL? I thought only boss and minato were. I havent heard anything about VIP closing? What is the reason for allof them to close anyway. I talked to he boss club manager and he didnt give me a reason for the closing only that tonight(monday) is the last night.

Date: 4/15/2002 8:34pm Name:   Hurricane Subject: Closing down Yeah. I heard that all the HC within City of Industry are shutting its doors. Now all the good-looking girls will be flocking to other HC in downtown LA. I think that's great!

Date: 4/8/2002 4:38pm Name:   DayDay Subject: Boss Club rules I had the best time at the Boss Club. Please say it ain't so

Date: 4/7/2002 2:12pm Name:   poke_her_man78 Subject: Good Bye Boss Club I'm sorry to say...but the word around the street is that Boss club will be shutting down at the end of the month (April)...that sucks... Some bastards were idiots and ruined it for everyone!! Oh well..thats life!! Peace

Date: 3/16/2002 7:07pm Name:   poke_her_man78 Subject: pretty cool experience Checked out Boss Club last nite with some buddies...Very cool...first of all, the girls were pretty good (MOST OF THEM) and the one I hung out with was very friendly..I like this place versus strip clubs, because its a different atmosphere. The girl I got was Hispanic, (forgot her name), but she was HOT! Strip club quality...she took care of me very well (not full service!)...let's say that you can get your rocks off with out emptying your pockets...peace

Date: 3/3/2002 11:03pm Name:   TenFree Subject: RE: I am a hostess, and it's great... Are you Asian Nicole, formerly of CF?

Date: 3/3/2002 10:16pm Name:   HotNicole Subject: I am a hostess, and it's great... I just wanted to let the guys know you will have fun. But if you are looking for sex, I will not do that.

Date: 2/12/2002 9:19pm Name:   david2001 Subject: not what it used to be I'm hearing conflicting reports on the status of this club. Some are saying it's as good as ever, but my visit there last week indicated otherwise. The old VIP room is now a kitchen (food looked good), and lights are turned way up in the remaining sitting areas. I've always found the girls at this club to be very friendly, so this club still ranks high on my list. But if you're looking for an amazing time like what was available in the past, you're likely to be disappointed.